10 Meter Mid Cabin "Refresh"

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RWS
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by RWS »

keep in mind that the soft components on this boat may well be original, and 35 years old or so

the soft parts were not designed to handle gas with alcohol - ETHANOL - and this fuel accelerates the demise of soft parts.

if you are a mid cabin your tank arrangement is very different than if your hull is express based. - I can help you with the latter.

RWS
1983 10 Meter SOLD after 21 years of adventures
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/

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zedtwentyate
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by zedtwentyate »

RWS wrote:first off remember that those fumes are heavier than air, and will settle into the lower areas of the boat

second - it's the FUMES that are EXPLOSIVE

ANY kind of spark will detonate this boat like a bomb

RWS

Happy Easter RWS. I am very aware I have a time bomb on my hands. I'm trying to sort the best way of removing the fuel at this point. Headed over to the boat now to plan my attack.

Good thing i quit smoking years ago...
Kegan

1986 Trojan F-27 (SOLD!!!)
1989 Trojan 10 Meter Mid Cabin
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zedtwentyate
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by zedtwentyate »

Currently siphoning what feels like 40 gallons of fuel and crap out of my bilge. There was no mopping this up!
Kegan

1986 Trojan F-27 (SOLD!!!)
1989 Trojan 10 Meter Mid Cabin
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by prowlersfish »

I hope its something simple , be careful
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zedtwentyate
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by zedtwentyate »

prowlersfish wrote:I hope its something simple , be careful

If only I knew then, what I know now. Famous words.

I've extracted most of the fuel at this point but now I have discovered the stringer nearest the port tank.

Chance of being in the water by Memorial Day = zero.
Kegan

1986 Trojan F-27 (SOLD!!!)
1989 Trojan 10 Meter Mid Cabin
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by oil&water »

Keep an open mind and creative thought. The repairs will progress much smoother that way.

Says the guy that has his whole rear deck, half an engine, some of the Genset, and all the hull and deck trim removed.

If I didn't, I would pay someone to let me use their heavy machinery to tear her apart myself.
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by RWS »

Chance of being in the water by Memorial Day = zero.

=====================================================================

I could tell you some stories........

but that wouldn't make you feel any better

it's not as bad as it sounds.........

isolate the problem and develop a plan

RWS
1983 10 Meter SOLD after 21 years of adventures
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/

WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
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BobCT
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by BobCT »

what do you mean by "stringer issue"? An issue with the stringer itself or the fuel leak? On the fuel, I can't see how the fuel fill or vent hoses could be the issue unless the tank was completely full and fuel was expanding. Once you burn off the top few gallons, both of those hoses are out of the picture. Not saying you shouldn't replace those given the age but would not expect either to be the cause of the leak.

Mid cabin tank leaks are almost unheard of but I'm stumped as to what else it could be (but thinking). Fuel sending unit, fuel line out of the tank to engines could all leak but again at the top of the tank. Hoping that the tank was filled to the brim when you stored it and a clogged vent line caused the issue.

On the stripes, yes they can be sanded off. I used an orbital with 100 to get through the clear and 220 to remove the color coat. Then I wet sanded and buffed to complete. I started out on one side like I was refinishing a piece of furniture. Once I realized how thick the gelcoat was I blasted right through it. Minimal chance of screw up here.

Bob
1988 10m mid cabin
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zedtwentyate
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by zedtwentyate »

BobCT wrote:what do you mean by "stringer issue"? An issue with the stringer itself or the fuel leak? On the fuel, I can't see how the fuel fill or vent hoses could be the issue unless the tank was completely full and fuel was expanding. Once you burn off the top few gallons, both of those hoses are out of the picture. Not saying you shouldn't replace those given the age but would not expect either to be the cause of the leak.

Mid cabin tank leaks are almost unheard of but I'm stumped as to what else it could be (but thinking). Fuel sending unit, fuel line out of the tank to engines could all leak but again at the top of the tank. Hoping that the tank was filled to the brim when you stored it and a clogged vent line caused the issue.

On the stripes, yes they can be sanded off. I used an orbital with 100 to get through the clear and 220 to remove the color coat. Then I wet sanded and buffed to complete. I started out on one side like I was refinishing a piece of furniture. Once I realized how thick the gelcoat was I blasted right through it. Minimal chance of screw up here.

Bob

Looks like my last post wasnt a complete thought.

When inspecting the fuel leak, I notice the limber hole nearest the tank hadn't had that fiberglass tube knocked out yet (i took all the other ones out in the fall in preparation to repair them). When i knocked it out, i was able to stick my finger all the way inside and pull out a TON of rot. I guess that means its time to cut that out, which needs to be done to remove the tank anyway from what I understand.

My only other thought with the fuel tank is that a lot of water got in and crept between the tank and what it is sitting on and cause some degradation of the tank. If you remember, Bob, my air intake box was rotted out and every time it rained, water just came right in through the side of the boat.

the fuel is coming from the underside of the tank for sure...

Thanks for the tips on sanding. Might be a project for next year at this point.
Kegan

1986 Trojan F-27 (SOLD!!!)
1989 Trojan 10 Meter Mid Cabin
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BobCT
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by BobCT »

Man, sorry it is actually the tank....my worst nightmare. I know which limber hole you're talking about, I replaced a section on my port side about 5 years ago. This where the stringer has that cutout for the exhaust correct? My rot only extended about a foot forward of the limber hold so I was able to do the repair by only removing the glass on one side.

If the rest of the stringer is ok, the tank can come out by taking (2-3"?) off the top of the stringer so it'll clear. That's how Todd Pote did it when he removed his tanks. That would save a ton of work assuming the rot you see is just a local repair. I agree, I believe the air intake boxes are the cause of the stringer issues (combined with the factory holes not being epoxied). When you get to that point, I can walk you through my setup now. When it rains, all of the water goes down the intake hoses and directly into the bilge. No water hits the tank or winds up trapped on the outside stringer. This way, the only limber holes that ever get wet are the forward ones near the bulkhead. While I was doing all of this, I also added some 1/2 moon cutouts on the stringers so there's no place for water to get trapped. The factory limber holes are a little to high because of the tubes and that one area all the way at the transom will never drain.

Double
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zedtwentyate
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by zedtwentyate »

BobCT wrote:Man, sorry it is actually the tank....my worst nightmare. I know which limber hole you're talking about, I replaced a section on my port side about 5 years ago. This where the stringer has that cutout for the exhaust correct? My rot only extended about a foot forward of the limber hold so I was able to do the repair by only removing the glass on one side.

If the rest of the stringer is ok, the tank can come out by taking (2-3"?) off the top of the stringer so it'll clear. That's how Todd Pote did it when he removed his tanks. That would save a ton of work assuming the rot you see is just a local repair. I agree, I believe the air intake boxes are the cause of the stringer issues (combined with the factory holes not being epoxied). When you get to that point, I can walk you through my setup now. When it rains, all of the water goes down the intake hoses and directly into the bilge. No water hits the tank or winds up trapped on the outside stringer. This way, the only limber holes that ever get wet are the forward ones near the bulkhead. While I was doing all of this, I also added some 1/2 moon cutouts on the stringers so there's no place for water to get trapped. The factory limber holes are a little to high because of the tubes and that one area all the way at the transom will never drain.

Double
The forward limber hole is the one in question. That's where i'll have to repair the stringer. I do need to resolve that intake box as well. its literally nonexistent right now...thanks Bob!

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Kegan

1986 Trojan F-27 (SOLD!!!)
1989 Trojan 10 Meter Mid Cabin
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by BobCT »

ugh, I thought it was the rear stringer. Ok, I think Todd Pote's posts will be a huge help. He re-did all of his and pulled both tanks. He's a great guy and I'm sure would be happy to talk to you if that helps (I have his contact info).
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by zedtwentyate »

BobCT wrote:ugh, I thought it was the rear stringer. Ok, I think Todd Pote's posts will be a huge help. He re-did all of his and pulled both tanks. He's a great guy and I'm sure would be happy to talk to you if that helps (I have his contact info).

Thanks Bob. I was actually able to speak to Todd on the phone earlier this week. He was super helpful and is a great resource to those of us with mid-cabins!

This weekend I will be draining what is left in the tank and beginning another clean up session. I am out of the country for the next week so I really want this contained while i am away. Once I am back, it will be time to attempt the removal without cutting out a stringer. Bob from Beacon consulted with John and they claim it can come out with a lot of cursing! We shall see!
Kegan

1986 Trojan F-27 (SOLD!!!)
1989 Trojan 10 Meter Mid Cabin
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zedtwentyate
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by zedtwentyate »

Got the tank out...

Dear old dad gave me a hand and helped me work up the confidence to cut the stringer out. Good thing I did. It was soaked with fuel.

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I believe the intake box is the root of all evil...

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Pin hole leaks in the tank! You can kinda see it the wet spots on the bottom of the tank

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As per Todd Potes experience, the rubber was barely held on in most places. It was a disgusting mess underneath the tank.

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Now, the extra bad news...the entire stringer is shot. It's soaked with fuel! Anyone who's good with fiberglass want to make a trip to beautiful Syracuse NY to help me fix it :)???

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Kegan

1986 Trojan F-27 (SOLD!!!)
1989 Trojan 10 Meter Mid Cabin
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Re: Planning My Haul Out and Motor Pull (Update: Motors are out with Pics)

Post by oil&water »

Man, do I ever feel your pain. I'm digging goo out of my forward deck. It's a mess and a nasty job. Your's is certainly more complicated since you cannot use a vacuum to extract the rotted pulp. Once you get the wood out, the replacement stringer epoxied into place, and the glass back over, it will be done and ready to enjoy.
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