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larglo
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Post by larglo »

bfly71,

I'm afraid your great comments are way above a lib's ability to understand.

Their eyes would begin to glaze over, before they got less than half way through.

As you have said, and I agree, that, I have to show my drivers license and other types of ID, to prove I'm within the law. So I would be proud to show an ID to prove I am an American. I would think legal immigrants would be more than happy to show proof.

Only people who have something to hide, would not like to do so.

Larry
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alexander38
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Post by alexander38 »

Bfly that's some good reading right there, But my remark was meant for the Fellow that took offense to me sayin his country has a Socialist govt. I guess he has no reply.
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N2itive
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Good morning

Post by N2itive »

I hope everyone had a safe, happy and altogether good weekend. Sincerely.

I'll reply to posts in reverse chronological order.

Alexandre, I do have a reply. I did take offense to the Socialist remark. My country is not Socialist, we have elected leadership, the party system, and the House of Commons, a Senate, etc. Very similar to your government, just different names. Where the confusion happens is that we have some large social programs (as you do) with the main difference being our healthcare.

To clarify, that healthcare system covers basics, and we are on the hook for specialists, many treatments not covered, etc. It's like an HMO, but gov't run. It's not a perfect system by any stretch and has been subject to alot of fraud by identity. An interesting sidenote (and not meant as a jab) is that many of the people seeking treatment under false pretenses here were "illegals"... and US citizens who had no or insufficient insurance is the US or could not wait for treatment. I think it's wrong for anyone to do that, however... I always try to temper my indignation by asking myself if it was my son or daughter who would not survive and there was no other option, would I do the same... There, but for the grace of God, go I.

On an aside, yes I have used the healthcare system, more than average in my youth... however, amortized out, our higher tax rates balance things out. And we get a shiny new tax on July 1st, the HST! :roll:

I don't know what government cheese tastes like. My wife and I have worked hard and continue to work hard for what we have, much like you and others here. We pay our taxes, try to raise our sons to be gentlemen and good citizens, and occasionally sit around on our boat having a beverage and relaxing.

Alexandre, we may disagree but I respect your right to your views, as well as the Service you rendered to your country. With your background I hope you can understand my aversion to being labeled anything resembling Communist.

Larglo, I used "checkpoint" as a term for any place a citizen would be detained and asked for proof of citizenship. I tried to come up with a better term but my vocabulary failed me. I think you get the jist anyway.

I notice you declined to answer my question, was that due to confusion about my terminology or because the answer is so obvious it needs no reply?

Also, I've worked hard and am highly skilled, I don't think my job is in danger from an illegal immigrant.

BFly, Those are some interesting stats. Kind of all over the map though, is it illegal immigrants, immigrants of any sort, or Hispanic immigrants you're against? I didn't see any reference to poor white folk either, guess they're OK because well, they look like Americans.

As I stated earlier, spin docs can take stats and use them to prove any stand, right or left. My eyes did glaze over, though, as I realized I was reading far-right propoganda cut and pasted. That post ending with the "Republic" was a dead give-away. I could dig up the same kind of pap that would show numbers that prove fat Americans are more of a burden on your country than immigrants, but won't because it's all marketing. How do I know this? Because some of those spin docs are friends and marina buddies. And they'd be the first to tell you, don't believe a GD thing you read in any media but Reuters and AP, the rest has all been cooked, spun, packaged and coated with a film of BS to make it slide down "Joe Public's" gullet.

I love the part about Appalachia and Black Hills... like the white folk there are all millionaires :)

You put it right on the money- if All-American soccer moms start getting asked etc. Honestly, what are the chances that'll ever happen? ZERO.
When was the last time you were asked to prove your citizenship that wasn't part of entering another country or making a financial transaction?
Pretty easy to support laws that in no way will ever affect you personally.

Which, I guess, is why you're so cool with other people getting detained and asked. Do you have any friends who are American citizens who look Hispanic or Middle eastern... why don't you share your view that it's OK for them to be detained and ask how they feel about it. I also am still waiting for your reply to my question- if you and your daughters didn't look white-bread American and were detained asked to to prove your citizenship, how would you honestly feel after the first few times? I'm going to go out on a limb here as say you'd get feisty.


A barrage of right-wing propaganda doesn't constitute an honest reply.

Let me ask you this, if you and your daughters were walking down to your boat, and were detained by an American citizen (Named Juan Luis or Ramon or Ahmed) and asked to prove your citizenship, where you were going, what you're doing there, what's in your purse?... would you be just hunky-dory with it?


Didn't think so.
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Post by bfly71 »

It would be all illegal immigrants that I am against. Using the mexican's is simply using the largest group of illegal immigrants. Please tell me when our largest population of illegal immigrants are Irish and I will change my tone immediately.

News flash - I am against anyone who breaks the law. Drunk Drivers, Drug Dealers, A Thief, Murderer's, you name it, if you are breaking the law - I am will not stand up for you.

I always carry the appropriate documentation when I am leaving or entering the country. I provide the appropriate documentation when conducting banking when needed. I hold multiple securities licenses so I have had to submit to numerous background searches, finger prints, etc and I am required to take annual questionairres and provide detailed personal information in order to keep my licenses. This is the career I chose so I need to do what is required of me. If people choose to move to this country, there are appropriate steps to take in order to accomplish that.

You may call what I posted right wing propaganda but the majority of those statics are provided by the National Center of Immigration. Not sure that that government agency is part of a right wing conspiracy but you could be right.

As for being worried about your job, of course you aren't worried about it. I am not worried about mine either but I am worried about where my taxes are going and the fact that I am paying for people who don't belong here when there are plenty of American's who need help. I believe in giving money to the homeless but I also believe that every able man/woman should work.

As for the Appalachia comment - have you ever been there? My family has, every year on a mission trip to help work on homes. The goal is to make these homes "warmer, drier and safer". These are American families who live without running water, doors and windows. Their children play in brooks that are contaminated with raw sewage. Last year Brittany was working on putting up facia in the house to keep the rather large poisonous snake that lived in the attic space out of the main house. While she was up on the ladder holding up the material as someone else was installing, the snake kept poking it's head out. She held firm and did what was needed to get done. The year before she was underneath a burnt out trailer trying to get plumbing put in so the family could have running water.

We send a group of people from our church to spend a week trying to make a dent in an impossible situation. This will be my daughter's 4th year and my husband's 2nd. It is the hardest thing they have ever done and yet it is something they look forward to each and every year.

This is done through ASP, if you want to check it out go to http://www.asphome.org and is completely funded through private donations.

Don't talk to me about sh*t you know nothing about.

As for my family and I walking down to the boat and getting stopped by an American named Luis or whatever looking for appropriate documentation - I could care less if they were purple and polka dotted - if they had appropriate identification that they had the authority to ask me, I would get my wallet out and provide my Driver's License and Wallet Size Birth Certificate. If I then needed to be detained until I could provide my passport, you better believe I would comply and I would not complain. Why? Because I am an American Citizen and I have nothing to hide.


You don't know me. You don't know what I would or wouldn't do so don't ever answer for me in your post.
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N2itive
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Actually, I do know s**t

Post by N2itive »

As far as being for or against criminals, please read my post waaaaay back where I mentioned that I was not for illegal immigration in any way.

Appalachia-I have been there. My point was that the poverty there knows no race or political boundaries. Nor in Detroit, Chicago, LA, or any of the other places I've been. Good for you to actually do something about it. Seriously. However, please don't use it as a soapbox.

If you'll read my post, I asked when have you been asked to provide any documentation that was not related to financial transactions. I guess you could include your fiduciary licencing in there. The question stands.

Forbes magazine? The Urban Institute? The Urban Institute is a right-wing think tank paid for mostly by RW corporations. Look it up. Now there's some unimpeachable, unbiased sources. Oh, and I don't recall any government agency referring to The US as the "Republic". The majority of what was posted is just statistics, singling out Hispanics. Like I said, the Left wing could roll out a bunch of stats opposing them.

As far as being asked to prove your citizenship, what you would or wouldn't do is purely hypothetical.. you never will be, is my point. You know it and I know it.
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oh, and...

Post by N2itive »

In the interest of accuracy, ASP is not completely funded by donations. They receive significant Federal Grant money, and are currently looking to hire someone just to manage that.

Fine people I'm sure and doing good work.

See? I DO know s**t. ;)
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larglo
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Post by larglo »

N2itive ask;

-----------------------
Let me ask you this, if you and your daughters were walking down to your boat, and were detained by an American citizen (Named Juan Luis or Ramon or Ahmed) and asked to prove your citizenship, where you were going, what you're doing there, what's in your purse?... would you be just hunky-dory with it?
-----------------------
This will not happen anywhere in the US or AZ. If you knew what you were talking about or took time to read the law that AZ passed you would know that.

The law states that there has to be probable reason to detain anyone before that question can be even asked, to prove your a US citizen. Law enforcement makes mistakes all the time in this country and others and it's not perfect. But I'd rather have it than what they have in Iran and a lot of other countries. I will wait and see how it works out, after in goes into effect, it can always be reversed.

To make this simple, so even you can understand, the main focus about all this is,,,,,I don't want illegal people in my country! That's not to hard to grasp. There is many, many reason's why this law was passed by AZ. The main reason is, our federal government is not doing it's job at protecting our boarders. The second reason is that the people who live in AZ are fed up with the immigration problem and took take matters into their own hands. I'm sure they don't like it any more than anyone else. But I'm not going to second guess them on it to much, because I'm not living there and do not have put up with all that's going on there.

I suggest you and others read the laws of other countries concerning their boarders. I think there are three people, right now being held in Iran, that walked into that country accidentally. Big difference from their way and our way, wouldn't you say.

The USA is far from perfect, but we give more aid than any other country in the WORLD. We're always there when other countries need us. We saved the EU's ass more than once over the years, and now some say we have to allow millions of people to come into this country illegally and we have to put up with it!
I don't think so! We are getting sick and tired of trying to be the care takers of the world, only to have some idiot say we have to do more!

I think this bullshit has gone on long enough as far as I'm concerned.

Larry
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alexander38
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Post by alexander38 »

I'll be short with my reply
Name spelled Alexander , or as my Grandfather spelled before an Anglo changed it Aleksandr :roll: (and I know why you misspelled it, you're be cute)
And I'm sorry to inform you but the US is a Representative Republic some what different than your Govt.
And your country and the EU are Socialist in nature sorry buts that's the way it is, And I know we have it in our system too and most of us want it stopped. It's our birth right to do so,
I don't want all immigration stopped I want everyone to come in the front door just like my family did and work to make this a better place not walk in a start taking from it.
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larglo
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Post by larglo »

printemailshare recommend (7) MEXICO CITY (AP) — U.S. officials confirmed Monday that an American citizen was found dead in northern Mexico.

The U.S. Embassy said the body of Ronald C. Ryan was recovered in Sonora state, across from Arizona, but gave no other details.

Jose Larrinaga, spokesman for Sonora state prosecutors, told reporters Sunday that Ryan's body was found the previous day partially buried near a creek on the outskirts of Santa Ana, a city 60 miles south of Nogales, Arizona. A cause of death had not been determined and the body was taken to the border city of Nogales, Mexico, for an autopsy, he said.

Larrinaga said Ryan, 67, of Phoenix, Arizona, had been reported missing May 3.

State police had reported detaining three men the following day who had left Ryan's pickup truck at a carwash in Santa Ana. Officers seized several automatic rifles, dozens of bullets and marijuana from the men, ages 18, 20 and 21, state police said.

Local media said two of the men are the son and a nephew of Jose Vasquez Villagrana, an alleged key operator of the Sinaloa cartel who was arrested in February.

------------------------------------

I think this about covers it all!

Larry
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bfly71
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Re: oh, and...

Post by bfly71 »

N2itive wrote:In the interest of accuracy, ASP is not completely funded by donations. They receive significant Federal Grant money, and are currently looking to hire someone just to manage that.

Fine people I'm sure and doing good work.

See? I DO know s**t. ;)
You are correct. Approximately .05% of there total donations are provided through Federal Grant Money according to their financial statement. Maybe in Canada that qualifies as significant.

And yes, you do know sh*t and can read the front page of the website too.

Also - I don't use it as a soapbox. I have a soapbox and can whip it out at will but it usually has to do with right vs. wrong, etc....Not used in this particular instance.

As for the documentation, please re-read my post. You missed something there.

Poverty does not know boundaries, however, it is concentrated is specific area's with specific factors. I don't decide who - I am just relying on the information provided across the board.

Show me some different statistics - I would love to see them. Preferably pie charts cause I am hungary and continue to feed the troll.
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Post by larglo »

Louisiana Woman Gang-Raped, Strangled By Mexican Nationals

THIBODAUX — Hours after his ex-wife went missing, Chris Fillinich walked through the abandoned house where she spent her last terrifying minutes and found an earring.

The star-shaped pearl earring confirmed for him that Angela Laudun had been inside, but it wasn't until later that he learned the disturbing details of her time there.

Four immigrant workers are accused of raping and killing Laudun, a 33-year-old from Cut Off, early Saturday morning inside that Galliano house, a place they had been hired to repair, authorities said.

The suspects then allegedly put her dead body in a Ford Explorer, drove south and hid her body in the woods off La. 3235 near Golden Meadow.

Gonzalo Cortes, 20, Esdras Garcia, 21, Luis Nava, 28 and Jose Moreno, 23, are each charged with first-degree murder and aggravated rape. The suspects, Mexican nationals working in Houma, remain at the Lafourche Parish jail. Each is being held in lieu of a $1 million bond.
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