Weak discharge with steam

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Man Cave
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Weak discharge with steam

Post by Man Cave »

Hi, I need some advice:

I got and F28 this year and love it. Both raw water cooled 318 engines run perfect. They start right up. But my port engine has very little salt water discharge and steam coming out. The engine overheats. I did blow a hose on a short run and saw water squirting out :shock: so I know the system is getting raw water. I replaced all hoses and checked my raw water pump impeller. I checked the intake strainer and cooler. All were were fine. I replaced my circulating water pump but it did not help. The risers are new last year so i think they are ok. The discharge is only spitting water with steam coming out. The oil looks fine and the engine does not misfire at all. What I can't figure out is where is the water that is being introduced to the system going? I suspect the flow is just being blocked because I blew one old hose first and then another old hose before replacing all of them. I have no problem doing mechanical and electrical work myself. I used a thermal gun to check for hot spots but only see the port engine being 100 degrees or so hotter than the starboard engine with not difference between engine areas, manifolds, or risers on the port engine.

Suspected causes:
1. Head gasket(s)
2. Warped head(s)
3. Blocked engine water jacket
3. Compromised cylinders (very bad)

Advice needed:

1. How should I approach this? Should I order head gaskets and pull them both and inspect? Should I have other parts on hand just to be ready? Its on a mooring and I usually just work on things in one marathon work effort even if it take all day. I don't want to go back and forth over and over again.
2. If I find engine water jacket clogged (original engines) can I clean that easily, or do I need special tools?
3. Am I missing any potential causes?
mikeandanne
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by mikeandanne »

Two things from your post.....the risers were replaced before you got the boat ? was this problem there then or after ?.....I believe it may be possible to orient the gaskets in the risers so as to block water flow if done wrong......have you run the engine without the thermostat, assuming this is raw water cooled......judging by your account of the engine running smooth and clean it may just be a blocked system somewhere, even old impeller bits....
Man Cave
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by Man Cave »

Thats very interesting about the gaskets. I will check that. I guess its better/easier to check the risers before jumping to the heads. Will blockage cause steam in the discharge stream though? The steam makes me fear water in the cylinders, but boy riser blockage would be much easier to deal with. I know the risers were replaced recently but I don't have any other info about it. I will start there and repost.
Man Cave
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by Man Cave »

I forgot to mention that I did run it without the thermostat with no change. Since put a new one in.
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gitchisum
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by gitchisum »

You should be able to hold your hand on the elbow at idle for a long time, If you cannot, something is restricting flow ( Gasket, deposit, etc.),

It is simple and cheap enough to replace gaskets and see if that fixes it.

Good luck
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prowlersfish
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by prowlersfish »

And insp the risers at the same time . Raw water cooled ? . I know you think its pumping water pull off a hose and run it for a minute.

Almost forgot look at your intake hose to the pump make sure its not a soft hose and its not collapsing .
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captainmaniac
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by captainmaniac »

I just wrote a bunch of stuff, then re-read your original post, and found out you have already covered most of it off...

Also make sure you are not guessing about getting good flow -- make sure any shutoff valve for the raw water is really wide open, and that intake (thru-hull) is not plugged with weed/barnacles/other crud, or excess paint. Strainer may be clean, but may have a blockage outside the hull. If temp is consistent all around the engine, seems to be access to coolant as opposed to a blockage within the system itself.
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Flyboy
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by Flyboy »

++ on the thru hull fittings. I sucked a fish up once, part of it got sucked into the thru hull inlet and got stuck there. Did not know it was a fish at the time, I back flushed the hose and the fish come floating out from under the boat with its side bulging out.
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Man Cave
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by Man Cave »

Thanks for all the advice:

Ok, just to close the loop on this one and provide some lessons learned for others in the future see below. This was a new expereince for me, but I am sure other folks have done it many times and knew the whole time. For those new members who run into the same symptoms:

Issue:
1. Bought used F28 Trojan with twin raw water cooled Chrysler 318's that both run well.
2. Both engines discharged water when I got it a couple months ago. But I have no frame of reference to how much they should discharge.
3. Port engine blew the inboard raw water hose that goes from thermostat housing to inboard manifold while underway, but all hoses showed fatigue, so I figured ok...just replace the hoses. When it blew it started filling the engine room with water. I was alone and saw the red bilge pump light energize on the upper console. I opened the hatch and raw water was gushing out, so I knew the raw water pump was working. I inspected the pump impeller anyway and it was fine.
4. I replaced the hose, then the hose between the water circulating pump and thermostat housing blew. I suspected excessive water pressure due to blockage at this point. BUT….PO had mentioned the risers were replaced last year and they looked new to me. Also, mechanic friends of mine (not boat guys) gave me advice that steered me toward other issues. With steam in the exhaust water pump, head gasket, blown cylinder, valves, were discussed. I know better then that but got caught up in it. The steam really threw me off though.
5. I replaced water circulating pump. It took me all day on the mooring, with many wakes going by. Too much fun. With the sun just setting I crank the engine with a big smile and ……NOT FIXED! :|
Then I rejected all advice. Slept on it. And reflected on the simplicity of the problem. With increasing back press and weak discharge obviously there is blockage. I removed the hoses at the exhaust manifolds and cranked the engine and water flowed fine. This meant blockage in either manifolds or risers. I reconnected hoses and used a temperature gun to measure hot spots and since I could see from one end to the other of inside the exhaust manifolds clearly it is the risers. Removed risers and sure enough, completely blocked off. I was still nervous about the cause of the steam (which I still don’t understand because it makes me think water is in cylinders) I cleaned out the risers best I could (the water jacket structures are solid). This took 2 tries because I didn’t do it well enough the first time. On second try I filled the ports with water and the water didn’t drain at all. So I cleaned and filled with water over and over until they were clear. See photo. I did this because I wanted to resolve the water flow issue and see if the steam was still present to determine the extent of damage in order to order ALL of the parts i would need. With risers clean the discharge is excellent and steam is gone. Thank god I don't have to pull a head or the exhaust manifolds aren't damaged. I ordered new risers for both engines and will replace them next week.


Lesson Learned regarding above:
1. I am going to install a bilge alarm when I get a chance.
2. Going to carry new extra hoses for all possibilities.
3. Do not assume steam in discharge is catastrophic. (Although I still don’t understand why it was there).
4. Weak discharge and increasing back pressure = blockage or bad pumps. Its that simple. This should have been obvious to me and I know better then to listen to land lubbers. My own fault.
5. I will never again try to clean a riser elbow again. The was such a pain and not worth it unless you have special equipment. I only did one side. I ordered new ones.
Man Cave
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by Man Cave »

Photos of above description.
Attachments
As removed
As removed
28- - 3.jpg (38.02 KiB) Viewed 7292 times
Cleaning
Cleaning
28- - 2.jpg (35 KiB) Viewed 7292 times
Water in ports that would not drain - at all
Water in ports that would not drain - at all
28- - 1.jpg (54.77 KiB) Viewed 7292 times
Man Cave
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by Man Cave »

I labeled the photos in the wrong order but you get the idea. Also, the second hose blew after I replaced the circulating water pump, not before. But it had nothing to do with the pump and replacing it was a complete waste of time and money. Anyway, hope his helps another person in the future and posts on this site have helped me so many times.
mikeandanne
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by mikeandanne »

Thanks for posting the resolution to your problem there.....it will be good for others as well as for trouble shooting.....that is something to see the extent of the blockage...
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by 1967 seavoyager »

A friend with a 318 in his Ventnor had a problem with one side of his engine hotter than the other. He was raw water cooled too. He pulled the soft plugs on the block & flushed out a ton of crap from around his cylinders. Engine runs good now.
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Big D
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Re: Weak discharge with steam

Post by Big D »

Although not the only possible culprit, the condition of your elbows are pretty typical causes of steam in the exhaust. The restriction causes fine streams or mist of water to be injected into the hot exhaust rather than large columns of water. The stream is easily burned off causing steam.
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