problems replacing manifolds on F36 440 engines

[dfg4240]

I thought I was doing good.starboard engine the manifold came off clean-even the gaskets didn't stick.
First problem came after getting the adapter nuts off. Can get the adapter to separate from the elbow.
I started on the starboard side of the starboard engine and got the nuts off but the adapter nuts were rounded.
I used a sawzaw to cut them off.
I pounded the manifold but it won't break free and same problem separating the adapter from the elbow.
The next time I go out I will have to bring a short stocky piece of wood and a heavy sledge type hammer.(short Handled one).
If I break it free I already gave up trying to separate the adapter from the elbow.I separated at the elbow and it looks dried out.
Looks like some sort of insert in the elbow and connecting coupler with a crimped ring type connector. I will separate both elbows and work on them outside the boat and try to separate them.
the other manifold came today but no gaskets yet.I paid $380 apiece for them and they are the old style and look beautiful.
I don't need an adapter on them just connect the elbow to the manifold. Am I nuts?
In the back of my mind I am thinking maybe I should replace everything now while I am into it and I should be good for the next seven years I hope.
I will take a pic of the elbow insides. (thats if I ever remember to bring my camera)
Looks rotted whatever is inside there-looks like it was once a black rubber insert that has a rounded sleeve that goes down into the elbow and the top of the insert is square.
Same with the coupler-has a sleeve that goes into the coupler and the top is a flat square.
both mate together flush with a metal crimped 2" piece of metal that connects the two together.

I'm new at this but is this the best technology in these boats.
I have a hot water boiler in my home and when I had the kitchen done just recently they used a new material for hot water radiators.
looks like a thick water hose - -but it can handle up to 180 degree water. What do we need all this cast iron crap for- if this is the best we can design then we are hurting
ok i'm done shooting off my mouth..
dfg4240

[prowlersfish]

That" cast Iron crap "is how old ?? they could have been stainless like mine are . Of course 1 new riser is only $1200 + and they still don't last forever . remember besides hot water they handle up to 1000 degs of heat inside along with byproducts of combustion . I think they do pretty good . Just my 2 cents .

[Commissionpoint]

That" cast Iron crap "is how old ?? they could have been stainless like mine are . Of course 1 new riser is only $1200 + and they still don't last forever . remember besides hot water they handle up to 1000 degs of heat inside along with byproducts of combustion . I think they do pretty good . Just my 2 cents .

And steam, and pressure, and repeated extended use over a period of years......

I'm with Paul. I think they do pretty good.

I have stainless ones on the Nautique. They are cool, and produce a nice exhaust sound. Different than the sound you get with cast iron.

[dfg4240]

That" cast Iron crap "is how old ?? they could have been stainless like mine are . Of course 1 new riser is only $1200 + and they still don't last forever . remember besides hot water they handle up to 1000 degs of heat inside along with byproducts of combustion . I think they do pretty good . Just my 2 cents .

And steam, and pressure, and repeated extended use over a period of years......

I'm with Paul. I think they do pretty good.

I have stainless ones on the Nautique. They are cool, and produce a nice exhaust sound. Different than the sound you get with cast iron.

They don't make the stainless for my boat-do they?
I wold buy them.

[Commissionpoint]

They don't make the stainless for my boat-do they?
I wold buy them.

You could start looking here:

http://www.keitheickert.com/c-9-exhaust-systems.aspx

[gettaway]

When we bought our current boat back in februay, the PO replaced the entire exhaust systems on both engines,(manifolds, risers and exhaust elbows and all fresh and raw water hoses, both raw water pumps and sent HE's for cleaning, once we we took possesion of the boat, I installed Perko engine fresh water flush kits in the raw water intakes of both of the crusader 350's. I bought the Salt-Away flush kit and I flush the engines after I take the boat out. Also, if I dont have the opportunity to actually take the boat for a spin, I run the engines in the slip, but have the sea cock closed and run the cooling systems from a hose and dockside fresh water. I always finsh with a dose of SaltAway. It is way too early to call this a testimonial, but from what I read on various sites, people who do this see and extraordinary increase in exhaust and cooling system life and easier maintenance when it is time to replace.

[Paul]

Scott,

Am I ever glad that I cruise in fresh water. Otherwise I'm sure that I'd be doing the same after every cruise and that sounds like a pain in the axx. I'm sure its well worth it though.

[gettaway]

seems that about 5 years is max on a set of elbows then the tell tale signs of overheating set in. HE's are 3-5 years between being pulled and professionally cleaned. it also seems that more use is better, keeps the crud flushed out.

[gettaway]

They don't make the stainless for my boat-do they?
I wold buy them.

You could start looking here:

http://www.keitheickert.com/c-9-exhaust-systems.aspx

wow did you see the cost of those exhausts--- you could replace elbows ever year for years !

[dfg4240]

here is the secret.
First I brought a small sledge hammer with me-it's a 12" handle heavy sledge.
I also had a 3 ft 2X4 and a 1 ft 2X4.
I hit it fairly hard on the ends of the manifold and it broke loose but it was still hard to back off of the bolts. It took quite a few whacks with pushing and wedging tapered wood down between the engine and manifold in between the whacks.
Guess what?---You can't get the manifold off on the starboard side after removing the nuts-the manifold hits the side of the enclosure .The manifold is flush against the side wall and the bolts are still in the manifold by at least 1./2".
I pulled it back in a little and supported it with ropes on each end tied to one of my extendable boat hooks.
Then I went to Lowes and bought a thin short pipe wrench and a good vice grip also just in case.
I put the pipe wrench on the bolt between the manifold and the block and broke all of bolts free that went into the block.
It took awhile as I used the vice grip also which worked a little faster for me and turned all the mounting bolts until they came out of the block.
I still had to adjust them just right to lift the manifold out.
What a pain in the neck-next I broke the adapters away from the lower elbows (both of them) were a piece of cake with the sledge and the 2X4..
Then I came home and tomorrow I will run a compression test on the cylinders hoping that there is no head gasket leak.
today was a good day. also the rest of the gaskets I needed came today.
dfg4240

[dfg4240]

They don't make the stainless for my boat-do they?
I wold buy them.

You could start looking here:

http://www.keitheickert.com/c-9-exhaust-systems.aspx

wow did you see the cost of those exhausts--- you could replace elbows ever year for years !

I was told it would not be worth it as they would have to be custom made and being in fresh water all the time would not be worth the cost over cast iron.
thanks
dfg4240

[gordd]

today was a good day. also the rest of the gaskets I needed came today.
dfg4240

Glad you making progress . Mine is 318 but similar issues .. and finally put it together.. Over next week will put rest of it together and hopefully fire t up next weekend . Don't give up as there is light at end of tunnel I don't like wires I got so will be replacing them with ones that have elbows going to distributor. and manifold will be degresed and cleaned up as well ..Like said don't give up .. it will come thru eventually

[dfg4240]

gordd
thanks-you were right,I did get it.
What a pain.the third bolt towards the top of the manifold must go in the manifold before trying to get the darn thing on.I had the first for bolts on from the bottom end one time and had to take the whole thing off because there is no room to get the bolt in on my boat because of the sidewall and the angle of the manifold.
Still confused about the water inlet elbows.-manual update says the water should enter the manifold from the bottom end (lower) of the manifold and the top front should b e plugged to eliminate manifold cracks from steam?
dfg4240
hope you have luck firing her up.