transom drain plug issue

todd brinkerhoff · Post by **todd brinkerhoff** » Tue Oct 26, 2010 8:18 pm

So my 10.8m express is up on blocks for the winter. I removed the drain plug at the bottom of the transom from the outside. It is a bronze through hull, and the plug came out easy enough. But after a few days, I noticed that the bilge still has a little water in it. So I figured the through hull may be plugged with gunk, so I put a long screw driver into it, and it stopped after going in about 1 1/2". So I took my flashlight and looked into through hull, and there is a piece of metal in the through hull that is completely torn up. I looks like someone tried to drill and pry in out with no success. I then proceeded into the engine compartment (in the rear on the express), and attempted to find my way to this bottom area with no success. The generator is in the way, but even if I removed the gen set, there appears to be a fiberglass subfloor above the hull. There is a couple very small access holes to the rudder assembly, but I cannot get even my hand to the area on the other side of this transom through hull.

So the question is, what the hell is on the other side of this through hull. The threads for the drain plug on toward the outside and only go in about 1/2". Would there be a plug on the other side. I cannot imagine this, because it would be impossible to access. Would there be something of importance on the other side. It looks like another plug. I'm a bit perplexed. Someone else apparently wanted it removed and attempted to use a drill, and I haven't noticed any issues. The grounding block is about a foot above this area.

rossjo · Post by **rossjo** » Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:09 pm

Todd - not meaning to be "Mister Obvious", but ... is there a plug on the inside? Perhaps the through hull was long enough that someone put one on the inside and outside?

On my (wife's) 14' McKee, we put the plug inside ... tied to a 400# leader.

If not - perhaps someone glued in a metal plug - never planning to pull the boat out on a trailer (was the prior owner an engineer?) ?

todd brinkerhoff · Post by **todd brinkerhoff** » Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:17 pm

I thought that, but I have no idea how they managed to install it, or how I would get it out. I will probably try to take the whole thru hull out by unscrewing it from the outside, but I'm concerned that it is jammed in there.

Miss piGGy · Post by **Miss piGGy** » Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:45 pm

Todd
My F30 Express has a bung with a wrench end on the inside of the boat and an Allen head on the other end. Must be so it can be removed from either side, but looks like it should be removed inside the boat as the bung is closer to that side of the through hull.. Good luck getting yours out.

k9th · Post by **k9th** » Wed Oct 27, 2010 5:22 am

rossjo wrote:Todd - not meaning to be "Mister Obvious", but ... is there a plug on the inside? Perhaps the through hull was long enough that someone put one on the inside and outside?

On my (wife's) 14' McKee, we put the plug inside ... tied to a 400# leader.

If not - perhaps someone glued in a metal plug - never planning to pull the boat out on a trailer (was the prior owner an engineer?) ?

(was the prior owner an engineer?) Now that's a cheap shot - and from the reigning BOY! Not every engineer is an idiot - just most of us!

rossjo · Post by **rossjo** » Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:36 am

I'm a Mechanical Engineer - and I often invent "non-traditional" solutions to normal problems. These are often undocumented and drive others crazy ...

k9th · Post by **k9th** » Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:47 am

rossjo wrote:I'm a Mechanical Engineer - and I often invent "non-traditional" solutions to normal problems. These are often undocumented and drive others crazy ...

I'm a mechanical engineer also, and we "never" (wink wink) change things without documenting it - but of such non-traditional and unconventional things are great inventions made.

rossjo · Post by **rossjo** » Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:53 am

Tim,

Absolutely

must have a fully documented ECO to make changes.

prowlersfish · Post by **prowlersfish** » Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:14 pm

rossjo wrote:I'm a Mechanical Engineer - and I often invent "non-traditional" solutions to normal problems. These are often undocumented and drive others crazy ...

And every once in a while it works

Allen Sr · Post by **Allen Sr** » Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:45 am

prowlersfish wrote:
rossjo wrote:I'm a Mechanical Engineer - and I often invent "non-traditional" solutions to normal problems. These are often undocumented and drive others crazy ...

And every once in a while it works

How about some odd's on that Paul? More or LESS?

RWS · Post by **RWS** » Tue Nov 02, 2010 12:19 pm

I don't know if this applies, but here's the info on the 1983 Express Curiser.

There is a full, finished & gel-coated vacuum liner in the engine room and in the entire area from the rear engine room bulkhead to the transom.

There is an air gap between the liner and the centerline of the keel.

Water can get in there, apparently by design, as there is a drain hole in the liner at the bottom of the lazarette.

The rear drain plug lets water out that may be under the liner.

It is possible that the debris you found could be a piece of trash/scrap that somehow found it's way back there.

A couple of observations.

1. with the boat on a lift, or on the hard, the aft end is generally placed lower than the fwd end, resulting in water draining toward the transom.

2. With the rear bilge pump mounted ON the liner, there is no way for that pump to evacuate all the water. When we did the refit and pulled the fuel tank, we decided to bravely take a sawsall and cut a hole in the liner to mount both the rear bilge pump, the bilge pump switch and the bilge alarm switch. This way whe nwe're on the lift (we never take out the plug unless we're on the hard) we can het more water out.

3. Interestingly, when this hull is in the water (generally speaking, might be different depoending on loading and fuel/water tankage) the rear bilge area is NOT the lowest point in th ewater, but the pivot point is, that is the area where the DELTA and the CONIC portions of the hull come together.

Sitting in the water at rest, water will accumulate in the forward bilge (lower) as I believe the forward bilge is connected to the rear bilge through the keel, running UNDER the built in waste tank between the center stringers.

I don't know how unique this feature is but it is definately an intended part of the engineered hull design and assembly.

So, this probably provided far more information regarding the question, and I don't even know if your 10.8 features the liner construction of the earlyier models, but I hope this can help you figure it out.

Regards,

RWS

P.S. Do all Trojans feature the bilge alartm system or is it limited to certain years or models. I don't recall seeing much posted about it here except by me.

BobCT · Post by **BobCT** » Tue Nov 02, 2010 1:34 pm

I have a bilge alarm (factory I believe) but only on the aft pump. My mid cabin and mid/engine room pumps do not.

todd brinkerhoff · Post by **todd brinkerhoff** » Tue Nov 02, 2010 1:36 pm

It definitely looks like a internal plug. I am posting another topic line on the hull of this boat. I had a 11 meter next to me on the hard, and I do not have anything close to that hull design. I need help in ID.

chauzer · Post by **chauzer** » Tue Nov 02, 2010 3:35 pm

rossjo wrote:I'm a Mechanical Engineer - and I often invent "non-traditional" solutions to normal problems. These are often undocumented and drive others crazy ...

so your "THE GUY" i cuss and swear about when i'm working on mechanical stuff!!! the search is over. now when i say, "if i ever find the guy who designed this, i'm gonna shove this wrench up his [fill in the blank]. i will finally know who i'm talking about!

rossjo · Post by **rossjo** » Tue Nov 02, 2010 4:29 pm

chauzer wrote:
rossjo wrote:I'm a Mechanical Engineer - and I often invent "non-traditional" solutions to normal problems. These are often undocumented and drive others crazy ...
so your "THE GUY" i cuss and swear about when i'm working on mechanical stuff!!! the search is over. now when i say, "if i ever find the guy who designed this, i'm gonna shove this wrench up his [fill in the blank]. i will finally know who i'm talking about!

Dude - NO ONE ever says "If I find they guy who designed this, he'll be walking funny" more than I ... you can ask my wife. Trojan may not have even had any ME's on staff. Many builders didn't.

The problem I saw was young, inexperienced or disinterested engineers/designers - who never worked with the type of products they designed. Bad ... The best people to design something are enthusiasts.