MONOMATIC HEAD

larglo · Post by **larglo** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:38 am

Hello all,

I have the original Monomatic head in our F25. Only later did I find out it uses the same water from the holding tank to flush with.
I doesn't sound appealing to me, so was wondering if there is a way to convert it to flush using a separate water tank and have the "stuff" go into another holding tank, which I could locate in the engine room where there is plenty of room to do so.

I was thinking about putting a separate holding tank in that area, but how would I get the "stuff" from the old holding area to the new tank in the engine room?

Any thoughts would be helpful, thanks,

Larry

captainmaniac · Post by **captainmaniac** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 12:54 pm

Is it one of the recirculating models? I have one of the original recirc models in my F32 (1 year older than your boat) and can describe my setup if you are running the same thing....

larglo · Post by **larglo** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:34 pm

I believe so. It uses the 4 gal of water that is required to be poured into the holding tank to flush with also. So every time it is flushed the water is coming from and recirculating from the holding tank.

Like to know what you did.

Thanks,

Larry

captainmaniac · Post by **captainmaniac** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 3:42 pm

I will see if I have any pics at home tonight, and get you some info off.

larglo · Post by **larglo** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:27 pm

Thanks a million, capt.

Larry

alexander38 · Post by **alexander38** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:37 pm

That setup just sounds s***y and smelly.

and why would they do that ?

Geoff R · Post by **Geoff R** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:38 pm

alexander38 wrote:That setup just sounds s***y and smelly. and why would they do that ?

Oh You are Soo correct on that one. I still have two on my boat I only use one at a time Lots of RV blue goo always have the sailing seal on . And pump very often. I am hopeing captainmaniac has some solutions

JGedridge · Post by **JGedridge** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:02 pm

Hi 'Lady G',

I just got done putting in all brand new vacu flush heads in my boat, and believe you, me, it wasn't cheap.

If you want to put the holding tank anywhere, you have to make sure that you have accurate space to get the tank in first! Next you have to determine how to plumb it.

This is a situation where you have to seriously think things through.

You aren't going to be able to use your Monomatic head and a seperate holding tank. That was in my Pacemaker ORIGINAL since 75 and it still worked!!!!! LOL. So when you get rid of it, plan everything out.

FYI: They don't make any more parts for the Monomatic head.

alexander38 · Post by **alexander38** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:31 pm

They don't make parts anymore

thank god

seems the cheapest way might be hand pump head and a thur hull to supply water then then to your holding tank.

captainmaniac · Post by **captainmaniac** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:52 pm

Sorry Larry (and others anxiously awaiting my response!!!) but the forum itself is p'ing me off again!!! I try to post my info to you and I am getting an error :

You don't have permission to access /wforum/posting.php on this server.

The last time I got this it was because I was being so audacious as to use the word "echo" (without quotes around it) in my post... but I don't have the energy tonight to figure out what the forum is p'od about this time... (already searched for that keyword... ain't there)).

Once I figure out how to make the forum accept what I am trying to write... I will pass it along... (and if the moderator knew how much I was swearing 5 minutes ago when I was tried to submit my original post.. I would be banned for that alone!!!)

Larry - I have GREAT info for you.... just gotta get the forum to accept it without puking on me!!!

EDIT : This time apparently 'system' was the bad word!!!! stupid friggin computers!!!! I architect, design, and build software for a living... I guess the story behind Ahhhnold's Terminator is coming true and the damn machines are starting to rise up!!

Captain Blast Off · Post by **Captain Blast Off** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:34 pm

alexander38 wrote:They don't make parts anymore thank god seems the cheapest way might be hand pump head and a thur hull to supply water then then to your holding tank.

I just finshed installing this exact setup in my old boat. Bought the manual head, plumbing, holding tank and hardware off craigslist for $100.00.

Larry my boat has twins in it but I was able to mount the 18 gallon holding tank beside one of the fuel tanks on the port side. This is a very easy installation here is a link that will help you with plumbing the system so you don't have problems http://www.boatus.com/boattech/casey/13.htm . The scariest part was cutting the 2" hole in my deck for the waste fitting.

I agree with the previous post make a plan and think it through "meaure twice and cut once" Super easy job; my head works like a charm.

Steve

captainmaniac · Post by **captainmaniac** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:36 pm

OK... Finally... (friggin...friggin..frigin computers)..

First of all... if picture sizes are too big I apologize (I told photobucket to shrink 'em, but not sure if this is working)... Second of all... I should have been in bed 2 hours ago, so if any of this is gibberish I will figure that out tomorrow and and fix it then (if I have time... work is crazy right now).

OK... if this is the pooper scooper

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here's how it is set up on my boat. May not be able to do the exact same on your F25, but you might be able to borrow on some of the ideas. Also, this is how it came when I bought the boat... so I didn't create this - just dealing with what it is. Don't know how 'factory' or aftermarket the solution is.

This is long... but hopefully worth it to Larry and potentially others with the same 'old school' equipment.

Head Operation
The head has a built in holding tank (ie - the entire base). You prime it with about 3-4 gallons of fresh water, and add a bunch of toilet chemical (years ago T-5 Toilet Chemical was common (used it on my father's boat from about 1977 until almost 2000), last 10 or so years I have been using Liquid Gold, and since I couldn't find it last year there was some Captain Phab product I used instead).

PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT : I am not affilitaed with Captain Phab in any way... but this past year has been the least oderiferous we have ever had with the boat... END OF PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT

The chemical serves 3 purposes - i) deodorize things, ii) help break crap (literally) down, and iii) help break down toilet paper. The head works on the same principles as many RV toilets, so if you can't find chemical for it at marine places you can try RV places or stores that carry camping supplies. When you use the head, whatever you 'deposit' ends up in the (recirculating) tank. When you flush, the liquids in the tank are used to flush/rinse the bowl. Just after a fresh recharge, flushes are essentially 100% fresh water + chemical. The more you use it, the more diluted the flush fluids are...

When it gets full (or just too stinky - stinky may come before full in warmer climates than 'Canuckistan'), its time to pump it out. In total the recirculating tank holds about 5 gallons I think... so if you charge with 3 gallons you can add 2 gallons of 'human residue stuff' to it before it's full.

Charging the System
On mine the head is plumbed in to my fresh water "system" (white plastic hose leading to the chromed fitting and pipe). That just means that when I have to recharge it I have a simple tap to turn on (on the chromed pipe) to prime it with the 3-4 gallons of water (from my fresh water tank, which I can then easily refill as needed). If you don't have this tapped in to your fresh water system you can prime it by just dumping a couple of buckets of water into it. In the picture, the purely plasticized fitting and pipe are for the vent. Flush button is the little 'momentary on' pushbutton on the back left corner.

Draining the System
You haven't said anything about how you pump out or empty your tank today.... (which kinda creeps me out a bit!!!) There is a fitting on the back of the recirculating tank for a drain hose (I forget actual size, somewhere between 2" and 2 1/2" I think). In my configuration this hose goes out through the forward head bulkhead, through a hanging locker, and then under the v-berth. There I have an 'external' holding tank that holds about 15 gallons. Here are a couple of shots of it. Fat white hose that goes in the top is the line from the head... thin white line is vent.

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(Ignore the green stains underneath... that's the colour of the old toilet chemical. The tank fittings leaked a while back but have long since been sealed... and for those in Californ-I-A the white powder is something called 'Baking Soda'... being used here as an odour absorber and also telltale to let me know if the fittings start leaking again.)

The head itself has no way of pushing or forcing contents out and to the external tank. To accomplish this there is an external manual pump (similar to this http://img.nauticexpo.com/images_ne/pho ... 256874.jpg) spliced into the hose between the head's recirculating tank and the external tank. The pump and its handle are in the hanging locker, so when I need to transfer stuff from the recirculating tank to the holding tank (because it's full, or just getting too odiferous) I crank on that for a minute or two. I have considered replacing this manual pump with a regular electric macerator pump, but so far am sticking with what I have.

I can transfer three full 'recirculating tank' fulls to the external holding tank before it is full. Then once I have a full external holding tank + another full recirculating tank its time to pay for a pumpout. Think we needed 2 pumpouts last year - and the second one was because the season was over and I don't store for winter without pumping out first!!!

At the base of the tank is a thick grey coloured hose - this is for pumpout.. and leads to my deck pumpout fitting.

Use
At the start of the season I prime the head with fresh water and fresh chemical. It gets used dozens of times without consuming any more water from the fresh water tank (because of the recirculating design). When 'its time'... I use the manual pump to transfer contents to the external holding tank. Then I recharge the head with fresh water and new chemical for the next cycle (and top up the fresh water tank if needed). When the head and the external holding tank are both full, its time for a pumpout. Pumpout sucks contents out of both the external tank and the head.... then I recharge the head and start all over...

For what it's worth : If/when this system 'craps out'.... I am probably going to replace it with a vacuflush system... but gonna milk this for as long as it keeps working (and/or I can repair it - 3 times so far, one of which was super-ICKY!!). 31 years and counting!!!

Torcan · Post by **Torcan** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:49 pm

I love that Larry has an F-25
I am also able to take from all of you some great ideas, and fixes.
Thank you

James

ready123 · Post by **ready123** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 8:49 am

Maniac... when you are thinking about head replacement you should also consider a composting head.
http://www.natureshead.net/

Here is one in a F32... two people every weekend with 2 guests for 2 weeks did not require more than one solids dump for the season (at end). No odour at all. Reclaimed tank and vacuflush space under V berth for storage... no pump out bills!

larglo · Post by **larglo** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:41 pm

Capt, all,

Your comments have been most helpful. Capt, I thank you for the time you spent in your reply. I do have a clear vision now of what I could do, to upgrade the head system. JD marine has a pump for $107.00, very reasonable and also a 9 gal holding tank for under $80.00.
Hooking it up to the water supply is also most helpful, no more lugging water in a gal jug to fill holding tank.
I have a pressurized 20 gal holding tank system for fresh water, and it would be simple to run a hose to the head.

I was wondering though, how could I tell when the 4 gal's have been reached in the head holding tank?
My one rule has always been, don't use the head unless you just have to, but, when ya gotta go, ya gotta go.

Thanks again.

Larry

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