Hi Mark,
Wow, she is really looking good. Great stuff and what a nice project you wil hae when complete.
couple of comments.
1. Now might be a great time to replace the mechanical fuel pumps. They're really easy to get to for you now an whop knows how old those are and how much life remais in the diaphraghms. Ntyan hours issue hee, but an age plus ethanol = potential prblem. If a diaphraghm went bad it could pump gasoline into the crankcase, a terrible problem in a boat where fumes can collect in the bilge and GO BOOM.
2. You probably won't be too hapy about what I'm about to tell you, but after Hurricane Charley the neighborhood was uning the head in my boat (by invitation, of course) Since it was mostly poo, I combatted the odor issue by using an extreme overdose of formaldehyde based head treatment. This softened up the RTV, silicone,5200, who knows seal on the waste tank lid which is also the "floor" between the stringers from the engine room bilge to the forward engine room bulkhead. So, with that seal damages, the poo sloshing around in the tank would leak out around the area where th lid fits on between the stringers. It was NASTY !
With the engines out, I removed the lid , repaired the surfaces that I damaged in the removal proces, cleaned the tank and resealed the lid.
No more leaks.
If yuou are interested, let me know and I'll post some pictures (which I believe I hav done before, do a search and they'll pop up)
I think you're lookin good and your project will be making lots of other guys on this site excited to the point of being fired up!
RWS
Project: Trojan 10 Meter Express
Moderators: BeaconMarineBob, Moderator, BeaconMarineDon
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RWS
- Ultimate User
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- Location: West Coast Florida
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1983 10 Meter SOLD after 21 years of adventures
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
-
RWS
- Ultimate User
- Posts: 2857
- Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 7:01 am
- Location: West Coast Florida
- Contact:
1983 10 Meter SOLD after 21 years of adventures
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
RWS,
Thanks for the feedback, much appreciated as always. A while back I contimplated installing new fuel pumps but I took it off the list because of their cost and the existing ones work. However, after reading your post I went and re-checked and I found the pumps at Partman for $100 so I'm going to order a couple today. For some reason my memory had them at @ $400 which is a whole different story. What can I say, I must be getting old and my memory....
As for the holding tank, just thinking about that job and process completely repulses me. Alot of things I can handle, messing around with open sewer and other peoples poo is not one of them. Without a doubt the most dreaded (for me) part of this whole project is going to be dealing with the head and making sure the whole system works. I don't think I have any leaks in the tank/lid but I still will have to deal with the head.
Thanks for the feedback, much appreciated as always. A while back I contimplated installing new fuel pumps but I took it off the list because of their cost and the existing ones work. However, after reading your post I went and re-checked and I found the pumps at Partman for $100 so I'm going to order a couple today. For some reason my memory had them at @ $400 which is a whole different story. What can I say, I must be getting old and my memory....
As for the holding tank, just thinking about that job and process completely repulses me. Alot of things I can handle, messing around with open sewer and other peoples poo is not one of them. Without a doubt the most dreaded (for me) part of this whole project is going to be dealing with the head and making sure the whole system works. I don't think I have any leaks in the tank/lid but I still will have to deal with the head.
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RWS
- Ultimate User
- Posts: 2857
- Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 7:01 am
- Location: West Coast Florida
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I belive to the best of my knowledge that the marine fuel pump is exactly the same as the one you would buy from NAPA.
You should confirm this before doing the expensive mail order version...
If you think the poo is no fun in that project, imagine a bit of it leaking out around the seal. . .
If you take the two hoses at the front of the tank and raise them up, then fill the tank with water so those hoses are full and well abovethe tank you will soon find out if you have a leak.
Remember my leak was self imposed by the overuse of formaldehyde head chemicals that softened up the seal.
It will cost you nothing but your time to check it out. Might be a good idea to put some bleach in that tank too.
Since the reseal I did I haven't used any chemicals in the head.
From time to time I will squirt some liquid dish soap down the bowl and have also used powdered dishwasher (Electrasol) detergent as well.
Rebuilt the head during the 2005 refit and no odors yet !!!
RWS
You should confirm this before doing the expensive mail order version...
If you think the poo is no fun in that project, imagine a bit of it leaking out around the seal. . .
If you take the two hoses at the front of the tank and raise them up, then fill the tank with water so those hoses are full and well abovethe tank you will soon find out if you have a leak.
Remember my leak was self imposed by the overuse of formaldehyde head chemicals that softened up the seal.
It will cost you nothing but your time to check it out. Might be a good idea to put some bleach in that tank too.
Since the reseal I did I haven't used any chemicals in the head.
From time to time I will squirt some liquid dish soap down the bowl and have also used powdered dishwasher (Electrasol) detergent as well.
Rebuilt the head during the 2005 refit and no odors yet !!!
RWS
1983 10 Meter SOLD after 21 years of adventures
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
fuel pump
I replaced both of mine proactively for the reasons RWS described.
My general philosophy is replace stuff before it breaks (in the slip) which provides me a good/known spare and in the process proves I have the right tools on board to do the job.
Be careful getting a pump from NAPA, I think they can order marine stuff but probably have it on the shelf. The marine version has the overflow connection which goes up to the carb. The regular big block pump will bolt right up and work but you could easily miss this detail.
One more reason.. it'll never be easier to swap the pump with all the stuff you have unbolted. The Stb side pump is a little tight, at least on the mid cabin.
Bob
My general philosophy is replace stuff before it breaks (in the slip) which provides me a good/known spare and in the process proves I have the right tools on board to do the job.
Be careful getting a pump from NAPA, I think they can order marine stuff but probably have it on the shelf. The marine version has the overflow connection which goes up to the carb. The regular big block pump will bolt right up and work but you could easily miss this detail.
One more reason.. it'll never be easier to swap the pump with all the stuff you have unbolted. The Stb side pump is a little tight, at least on the mid cabin.
Bob
1988 10m mid cabin
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RWS
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- Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 7:01 am
- Location: West Coast Florida
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Can't locate the 9:02 post, however, rather than install speakers where cosmetically compromising holes need to be cut and or where speakers are suseptible to salt spray and or UV damage, I mounted my cockpit speakers as follows:
one pair under the port/starboard gunnels, just forward of the helm seats. These face downward.
a second pair were installed by the original owner again under the gunnels but these are located aft, under the wide teak - port/starboard, again facing down.
This installation keeps the speakers out of the weather, the snlight and and out of direct water spray when washing her down.
All are controlled by the factory helm volume switch (which I replaved with the incorrect impedience, maybe someone can help me on this item)
The rear BOSE speakers were old when I got the boat, I got 9 years out of them myself before replacing the innards last year.
All four of these speakers are unseen, unless you are laying on the deck, looking up.
RWS
one pair under the port/starboard gunnels, just forward of the helm seats. These face downward.
a second pair were installed by the original owner again under the gunnels but these are located aft, under the wide teak - port/starboard, again facing down.
This installation keeps the speakers out of the weather, the snlight and and out of direct water spray when washing her down.
All are controlled by the factory helm volume switch (which I replaved with the incorrect impedience, maybe someone can help me on this item)
The rear BOSE speakers were old when I got the boat, I got 9 years out of them myself before replacing the innards last year.
All four of these speakers are unseen, unless you are laying on the deck, looking up.
RWS
1983 10 Meter SOLD after 21 years of adventures
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
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RWS
- Ultimate User
- Posts: 2857
- Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 7:01 am
- Location: West Coast Florida
- Contact:
the rear speakers were from th eoriginal owner and were in Bose factory encloures.
For the forward cockpit speakers, you will have to remove the panels under the gunnels and will find the wood screws hidden behing the sound insulation.
Ran the wires under the gunnel at the rear and around the transom to the other side.
Also, while you are at it, I highly reccomend adding red rope lights to the same area.
What a spankingly nice effect !
the original owner had NEON which didn't work well and made tremendous noise.
RWS
For the forward cockpit speakers, you will have to remove the panels under the gunnels and will find the wood screws hidden behing the sound insulation.
Ran the wires under the gunnel at the rear and around the transom to the other side.
Also, while you are at it, I highly reccomend adding red rope lights to the same area.
What a spankingly nice effect !
the original owner had NEON which didn't work well and made tremendous noise.
RWS
1983 10 Meter SOLD after 21 years of adventures
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
Gents,
Wanted to give an update on some progress I’ve made. Unfortunately the weather recently hasn’t been kind to “boat time†but I have accomplished a lot. The engine bay is almost done which is a big milestone for me. I still have a lot of little stuff to do but she’s come a long way. Below are some before and after pics. Everything was a real mess and needed some drastic attention.
Aside from the evident cleaning, cleaning , more cleaning and painting I did the following:
Installed all new hoses, belts, etc. using new stainless or bronze hardware.
Rebuilt both carburetors
Had the starters and alternators rebuilt
Installed new fuel pumps
Rebuilt the raw water pumps and installed new impellers
Installed new billet electronic ignition distributors
Installed new ignition coils and wires
Installed all new exhaust including manifolds, risers, elbows, everything.
Next on the agenda is to install all of the new seacocks. Then I can put the generator back in so I can finish up the exhaust installation. I still need to attach the throttle and transmission cables but I might install some new ones. I need to run the new fuel lines and install the filters and water separators. After the generator is in I can install the battery box and do the re-wiring of that. That should get me pretty close to firing the ole girl back up.
Before......
After........
Wanted to give an update on some progress I’ve made. Unfortunately the weather recently hasn’t been kind to “boat time†but I have accomplished a lot. The engine bay is almost done which is a big milestone for me. I still have a lot of little stuff to do but she’s come a long way. Below are some before and after pics. Everything was a real mess and needed some drastic attention.
Aside from the evident cleaning, cleaning , more cleaning and painting I did the following:
Installed all new hoses, belts, etc. using new stainless or bronze hardware.
Rebuilt both carburetors
Had the starters and alternators rebuilt
Installed new fuel pumps
Rebuilt the raw water pumps and installed new impellers
Installed new billet electronic ignition distributors
Installed new ignition coils and wires
Installed all new exhaust including manifolds, risers, elbows, everything.
Next on the agenda is to install all of the new seacocks. Then I can put the generator back in so I can finish up the exhaust installation. I still need to attach the throttle and transmission cables but I might install some new ones. I need to run the new fuel lines and install the filters and water separators. After the generator is in I can install the battery box and do the re-wiring of that. That should get me pretty close to firing the ole girl back up.
Before......
After........
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RWS
- Ultimate User
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- Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 7:01 am
- Location: West Coast Florida
- Contact:
Mark,
Thanks for keeping us up to date on your project.
I really prefer the Pontiac Blue over the Crusader Blue - nice contrast.
Couple of comments:
1. If you haven't already, be sure to free up the adjustments on the 4 motor mounts. Mine were frozen and nothing would move them withouit fear of breaking the plastic joints.
2. Be certain to re-algn the motors to the shafts - now this needs to be done IN THE WATER as the boat will rest far differently on the yard stands than it wil in the water. This procedure is done with a feeler guage at the coupler and is absolutely critical !
3. Have you considered where you will mount the HVAC compressor unit?
4. If you are missing th wiring chase covers, they are available through WW Graingers, let me know if you need the manufacturers info, I have it somewhere.
5. I'm sure you confirmed the elecronic ignition changeover is compoatible with a marine envionment and the advance curve is for the Crusder set up.
6. Now would be a good time to replave thoe sanitation hoses. Don't skimp here, get the best quality as they will eventually become "permeated" with odor.
Looks like you are building this boat for RELIABILITY and doing everything with one eye on making certain she starts up every time and that she never leaves you stranded. You mighht consider using one of those labelmakers to identify non-factory wires. I found thi to be a tremendous time saver for me under the dash, under the helm and in the engine room too.
GREAT STUFF!
RWS
Thanks for keeping us up to date on your project.
I really prefer the Pontiac Blue over the Crusader Blue - nice contrast.
Couple of comments:
1. If you haven't already, be sure to free up the adjustments on the 4 motor mounts. Mine were frozen and nothing would move them withouit fear of breaking the plastic joints.
2. Be certain to re-algn the motors to the shafts - now this needs to be done IN THE WATER as the boat will rest far differently on the yard stands than it wil in the water. This procedure is done with a feeler guage at the coupler and is absolutely critical !
3. Have you considered where you will mount the HVAC compressor unit?
4. If you are missing th wiring chase covers, they are available through WW Graingers, let me know if you need the manufacturers info, I have it somewhere.
5. I'm sure you confirmed the elecronic ignition changeover is compoatible with a marine envionment and the advance curve is for the Crusder set up.
6. Now would be a good time to replave thoe sanitation hoses. Don't skimp here, get the best quality as they will eventually become "permeated" with odor.
Looks like you are building this boat for RELIABILITY and doing everything with one eye on making certain she starts up every time and that she never leaves you stranded. You mighht consider using one of those labelmakers to identify non-factory wires. I found thi to be a tremendous time saver for me under the dash, under the helm and in the engine room too.
GREAT STUFF!
RWS
1983 10 Meter SOLD after 21 years of adventures
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
I like the before pictures better 
That really does look amazing. As good as I think my Crusaders look, you can't beat pulling everything off and starting over.
The manufacturer for the covers is Panduit. I called them and they sent me a sample at no cost, I was missing one section. You want 4"x1.5". I think the piece they sent me was 3'. Why these always seem to be missing is beyond me. I guess they get overstuffed w/wires over the years and people give up on trying to make them fit.
On the mounts, get the right tool! The "rod through the holes" method doesn't work and you'll crack them everytime. They make a specific tool that goes on a 1/2" drive so you rotate the mount from the top.... that's what those slots are for.
Good advice on freeing them up now while you have so much room and time to get them turning easily.
I can't believe how much room the Express has around the engines compared to the mid cabin layout. The stringers are so much higher up next to the engines. I just changed the trans/oil cooler lines (which it looks like you did too) and it was a huge PIA. In your pic, I'm looking right at them!
Bob
That really does look amazing. As good as I think my Crusaders look, you can't beat pulling everything off and starting over.
The manufacturer for the covers is Panduit. I called them and they sent me a sample at no cost, I was missing one section. You want 4"x1.5". I think the piece they sent me was 3'. Why these always seem to be missing is beyond me. I guess they get overstuffed w/wires over the years and people give up on trying to make them fit.
On the mounts, get the right tool! The "rod through the holes" method doesn't work and you'll crack them everytime. They make a specific tool that goes on a 1/2" drive so you rotate the mount from the top.... that's what those slots are for.
Good advice on freeing them up now while you have so much room and time to get them turning easily.
I can't believe how much room the Express has around the engines compared to the mid cabin layout. The stringers are so much higher up next to the engines. I just changed the trans/oil cooler lines (which it looks like you did too) and it was a huge PIA. In your pic, I'm looking right at them!
Bob
1988 10m mid cabin
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RWS
- Ultimate User
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- Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 7:01 am
- Location: West Coast Florida
- Contact:
Bob,
Thanks for the tip on the mounts - 'cept my Crusaders went bye bye.
By the way, NOW would be a GREAT TIME to add an intregal oil changer pump.
Mine is located in the lazarette with a line to each oil pan and the genny.
I buy oil in gallon jugs keeping a few empty spares around to drain first, and do all the work in the lazarette, change the oil filters and away you go !
Unbelievable time saver !
RWS
Thanks for the tip on the mounts - 'cept my Crusaders went bye bye.
By the way, NOW would be a GREAT TIME to add an intregal oil changer pump.
Mine is located in the lazarette with a line to each oil pan and the genny.
I buy oil in gallon jugs keeping a few empty spares around to drain first, and do all the work in the lazarette, change the oil filters and away you go !
Unbelievable time saver !
RWS
1983 10 Meter SOLD after 21 years of adventures
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
Yanmar diesels
Solid Glass Hull
Woodless Stringers
Full Hull Liner
Survived Andrew Cat 5,Eye of Charley Cat 4, & Irma Cat 2
Trojan International Website: http://trojanboat.com/
WEBSITE & SITELOCK TOTALLY SELF FUNDED
Thanks guys for the compliments and information, greatly appreciated.
I have the chase covers, just haven't put them back on yet.
I will be sure to loosen up the motor mount adjusters. I can't find any special wrench for this anywhere, anyone know what it looks like or where to get them? I could probably fabricate one if I knew what its suppose to look like.
The HVAC compressor is already mounted in a recessed enclosure on the forward bulkhead of the engine bay. But I don't have the cover re-installed for that either.
The electronic ignition distributors are Mallory's and they are designed specifically for marine use so I should be covered.
To replace the sanitation hoses, do I need to remove the existing ones to do that ?
Just the thought of pulling those off sends shivers of stink down my spine. You didn't know I was such a sissy!
I have a label maker and definitely plan on using it. I'll have plenty of questions for everyone when I get into the electrical stuff!
RWS, I can't believe you picked out the pontiac color! I actually started off with chevy blue but when I painted with it, it was much too dark for my liking so I tried the pontiac and I liked it a lot better.
I have the chase covers, just haven't put them back on yet.
I will be sure to loosen up the motor mount adjusters. I can't find any special wrench for this anywhere, anyone know what it looks like or where to get them? I could probably fabricate one if I knew what its suppose to look like.
The HVAC compressor is already mounted in a recessed enclosure on the forward bulkhead of the engine bay. But I don't have the cover re-installed for that either.
The electronic ignition distributors are Mallory's and they are designed specifically for marine use so I should be covered.
To replace the sanitation hoses, do I need to remove the existing ones to do that ?
Just the thought of pulling those off sends shivers of stink down my spine. You didn't know I was such a sissy!I have a label maker and definitely plan on using it. I'll have plenty of questions for everyone when I get into the electrical stuff!
RWS, I can't believe you picked out the pontiac color! I actually started off with chevy blue but when I painted with it, it was much too dark for my liking so I tried the pontiac and I liked it a lot better.
