Repowering my F32
Moderators: BeaconMarineBob, Moderator, BeaconMarineDon
Repowering my F32
I have an F32 with the original 270hp crusaders. I now have to repower and would really like to go with diesels (220 to 300hp). Can anyone give me insight on which engines will fit in the engine room without having to do major re-fab. Any recommendations of which engines that will work? What existing equipment can be used (shaft's etc.). Any line on good second hand Cummins 6bta's or 6cta's, on the market........My desired outcome and use of my vessel is mainly to cruise and camp along the ICW. Would like to be able to make some lengthy trips that would not eat you alive on feul cost. I do limited fishing in the Gulf of Mexico. Any help would be greatly appreciated. My F32 is a 1987 model...Thanks Rick
Rick,
most pleasure duty diesels (4 or 6 cylinders) in the power range your looking at will fit fairly easily. I've even seen Cat 3208's in there but it was very cramped. Due to size and weight, I'd avoid the Cummins CT series, as well as the Cat 31xx and 3208 series.
I have twin 200 Hp Volvo diesels in my F-32 and I'm very happy with my economy but I wouldn't mind a little more speed (my F-32 cruises at 20 knots and tops out at 24 knots.) I think the boats sweet spot is right around twin 250 hp engines. Twin 300's will work but they are likely over kill and twin 200's will also work but may favor economy over speed. In that power range, there are quite a few good options... it really depends if you want to go new or used.
Going used I'd be OK with Cummins, Volvo or Yanmar. I'm partial to the Cummins 6B series. Great engines, lots of availabilty, reasonable parts, plenty of support. You can also find Volvo's at reasonable prices going in but once you have them, they aren't as easy on your wallet for parts and support (although they are likely more economical than the Cummins). Finding used Yanmars is tough as they do commnd a premium and they are also pricey to support. I would not look at other used options that may look attractive going in (like detroits, penninsular, perkins etc..)..
Going new there are even more options. Here the gating factor is cost and what you expect for support vesus what you want to do yourself. On the low side you have options like the Cummins reman program (great option). For a little more you can step up to newer technology with unproven local support from players like Steyr and Iveco (very cost effective per HP and impressive engines). For even more you have the staples like Cummins QSB, Volvo D series and Yanmar when the finally decide to release their new tier 2 compliant engines.
It all depends on what you want and how much you want to spend. We each have to decide what criteria is important to us. The important ones to me were: 1)Weight versus horsepower since very heavy engines will consume some of their own power to overcome the weight burden. For example, my boat with 200's performs better than some F-32's with higher horsepower 6BT's and 3208's becuase of weight. 2) Budget - I didn't want to sink too much money into my F-32 since you will only recover a fraction of your investment AND this type of project reaches well beyond the engines alone. 3) Long term reliabilty. Will the engines, parts and support be a problem 5-10 or 15 years down the road.
Good luck.
most pleasure duty diesels (4 or 6 cylinders) in the power range your looking at will fit fairly easily. I've even seen Cat 3208's in there but it was very cramped. Due to size and weight, I'd avoid the Cummins CT series, as well as the Cat 31xx and 3208 series.
I have twin 200 Hp Volvo diesels in my F-32 and I'm very happy with my economy but I wouldn't mind a little more speed (my F-32 cruises at 20 knots and tops out at 24 knots.) I think the boats sweet spot is right around twin 250 hp engines. Twin 300's will work but they are likely over kill and twin 200's will also work but may favor economy over speed. In that power range, there are quite a few good options... it really depends if you want to go new or used.
Going used I'd be OK with Cummins, Volvo or Yanmar. I'm partial to the Cummins 6B series. Great engines, lots of availabilty, reasonable parts, plenty of support. You can also find Volvo's at reasonable prices going in but once you have them, they aren't as easy on your wallet for parts and support (although they are likely more economical than the Cummins). Finding used Yanmars is tough as they do commnd a premium and they are also pricey to support. I would not look at other used options that may look attractive going in (like detroits, penninsular, perkins etc..)..
Going new there are even more options. Here the gating factor is cost and what you expect for support vesus what you want to do yourself. On the low side you have options like the Cummins reman program (great option). For a little more you can step up to newer technology with unproven local support from players like Steyr and Iveco (very cost effective per HP and impressive engines). For even more you have the staples like Cummins QSB, Volvo D series and Yanmar when the finally decide to release their new tier 2 compliant engines.
It all depends on what you want and how much you want to spend. We each have to decide what criteria is important to us. The important ones to me were: 1)Weight versus horsepower since very heavy engines will consume some of their own power to overcome the weight burden. For example, my boat with 200's performs better than some F-32's with higher horsepower 6BT's and 3208's becuase of weight. 2) Budget - I didn't want to sink too much money into my F-32 since you will only recover a fraction of your investment AND this type of project reaches well beyond the engines alone. 3) Long term reliabilty. Will the engines, parts and support be a problem 5-10 or 15 years down the road.
Good luck.
it was well worth it to me and I really enjoyed the experience. I'd do it again in a heartbeat and I don't think I'll ever go back to a gas boat.
As far as the Cummins remans, the best place I could send you (not knowing your location) would be the next major local boat show. Cummins is usually well represented and may even have some show specials to share. If you decide to do this, I highly recommend you become member of boatdiesel.com. It's a memebership that will pay for itself 100 fold if you decide to do this repower.
As far as the Cummins remans, the best place I could send you (not knowing your location) would be the next major local boat show. Cummins is usually well represented and may even have some show specials to share. If you decide to do this, I highly recommend you become member of boatdiesel.com. It's a memebership that will pay for itself 100 fold if you decide to do this repower.
Bud-
I envy your great circle plans... in my case that would involve a divorce that I can't afford, so I'm relegated to living vicariously through others.
To answer your questions:
Cost of conversion: around 30K - thats DECEPTIVE so please understand what was involved -** NO LABOR COSTS- The big contributers were: Used engines, new gears, 2 stage couplers, coolers, engine systems majored (seals,belts, hoses,paint,exchanger cleanings,injection system rebuilds, all filters, valve and timing adjustments, new elbows etc.), new fuel system including tank, racors & lines, controls, gages, exhaust, raw water intakes. Some other small stuff like prop adjustments etc.
As far as efficeincy goes, I can't honestly say for sure at hull speed (7-8 knots) becuase I rarely operate there. Depending on the setup, I would guess 2-3 miles per gallon??... maybe more?? Once on plane, efficiency is fairly close from 15 knots to 20 knots (around 1.6 MPG @15 knots - 1.4 MPG @ 20 knots).
Optimal planning speed - thats a tougher one and very conditions dependant. In calm water, the boat "feels" best at 23-24 knots... below that and it feels like it's not "quite" up on it's toes. As conditions decline, 18-20 knots with correct trim seems to work. My boat is on plane as low as 14-15 knots but it feels like it's pushing harder at that speed than at higher speeds... if that makes sense.
Good luck.
I envy your great circle plans... in my case that would involve a divorce that I can't afford, so I'm relegated to living vicariously through others.
To answer your questions:
Cost of conversion: around 30K - thats DECEPTIVE so please understand what was involved -** NO LABOR COSTS- The big contributers were: Used engines, new gears, 2 stage couplers, coolers, engine systems majored (seals,belts, hoses,paint,exchanger cleanings,injection system rebuilds, all filters, valve and timing adjustments, new elbows etc.), new fuel system including tank, racors & lines, controls, gages, exhaust, raw water intakes. Some other small stuff like prop adjustments etc.
As far as efficeincy goes, I can't honestly say for sure at hull speed (7-8 knots) becuase I rarely operate there. Depending on the setup, I would guess 2-3 miles per gallon??... maybe more?? Once on plane, efficiency is fairly close from 15 knots to 20 knots (around 1.6 MPG @15 knots - 1.4 MPG @ 20 knots).
Optimal planning speed - thats a tougher one and very conditions dependant. In calm water, the boat "feels" best at 23-24 knots... below that and it feels like it's not "quite" up on it's toes. As conditions decline, 18-20 knots with correct trim seems to work. My boat is on plane as low as 14-15 knots but it feels like it's pushing harder at that speed than at higher speeds... if that makes sense.
Good luck.
Thnaks for all of the info. Lotto win is in order to pay the gas bill for the circle. How many squirrels does it take to push an F32?
$30K plus!!!!! That's o lot o diesel to make up the cost.
Thx again
BTW - divorce was six years ago. Sold the boat last year. Now I'm in between relationships. Other than christening a new boat, I don't see any ceremonies in my future!
$30K plus!!!!! That's o lot o diesel to make up the cost.
Thx again
BTW - divorce was six years ago. Sold the boat last year. Now I'm in between relationships. Other than christening a new boat, I don't see any ceremonies in my future!
-
JuiceClark
- Moderate User
- Posts: 388
- Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 10:20 am
- Location: Fort Myers, FL
Dream trip
You lucky bugger...how awesome would the great loop be?! It's a dream of my wife and I.
If we were taking our F-36 all the way around, I'd be looking for a great deal on a couple of used diesels. They'd be small and light as possible...but I don't do aluminum parts in my engines. Diesels just keep running when you use them everyday like that...I wouldn't worry about buying new ones.
One last thing...I've noticed my new 4 blade props do a lot better under 20 mph than the 3 blade ones I used to have. If you're doing a lot of slow cruising, I'd opt for the 4 blades for better efficiency at mellow speeds.
If we were taking our F-36 all the way around, I'd be looking for a great deal on a couple of used diesels. They'd be small and light as possible...but I don't do aluminum parts in my engines. Diesels just keep running when you use them everyday like that...I wouldn't worry about buying new ones.
One last thing...I've noticed my new 4 blade props do a lot better under 20 mph than the 3 blade ones I used to have. If you're doing a lot of slow cruising, I'd opt for the 4 blades for better efficiency at mellow speeds.
My F32
My F32 with Twin Cummins 6BTAs gets about 1mpg on plane - much better at "hull speed" = about 8knots. But thats a long circle )we plan to go some day as well).
I've talked to people who have done the Great Circle on trawlers - 1 year and about 3000 gals of fuel - not bad!
On the other hand, we just took a 7-day cruise last week (ship left from Charleston - 5 miles from my house, dock & boat). It was 3150 miles total @ around 18-19 knots. The Grea Circle would be much more interesting - but try a week with your wife on a trip first to see if you like it (or her, or she likes you - or if you even like to be with yourself that long - ha!).
I've talked to people who have done the Great Circle on trawlers - 1 year and about 3000 gals of fuel - not bad!
On the other hand, we just took a 7-day cruise last week (ship left from Charleston - 5 miles from my house, dock & boat). It was 3150 miles total @ around 18-19 knots. The Grea Circle would be much more interesting - but try a week with your wife on a trip first to see if you like it (or her, or she likes you - or if you even like to be with yourself that long - ha!).
Captain Ross, 2009 Trojan Boater of the Year
"Viva Mahia" F32 Cummins 6BTA diesels,
"Mack Attack" Chaparral 244 Fish, SeaPro 180, McKee 14, Montauk-17
"Viva Mahia" F32 Cummins 6BTA diesels,
"Mack Attack" Chaparral 244 Fish, SeaPro 180, McKee 14, Montauk-17