Re-Power Trojan F30 Sedan

[AbsterMcgee]

I want to thank all for previous help in getting my Chrysler 400B propped right & boat moving ! But Alas, going to give it up for a more economical / reliable re-power.

I am looking at re-powering using a Detroit Desiel 4-53N natually aspired series engine to power this single rudder, after speaking with reps from a re-power supplier in Ft Lauderdale, Fl. this was there recomendation. The engine will be a recon, 0 hour implant, 140 hp, reason to stay at this power is to maintain the 1" shaft, and continue to use my Velvet Drive 72C 1:1 ratio Trans, will have to go to a bigger wheel & pitch to get the speed back.

Any Desiel people out there have any input or previous experience as to this engine?

Thanks
Abster

[Danny Bailey]

Heavy, noisy, poor fuel economy and leaks oil. Also forget ever planing your boat again. If you want to turn your boat into a trawler, there are much better choices in diesels.

[AbsterMcgee]

Thanks Danny,

What do you think, I have a 1996 6BTA in my Dodge Dually, ( only 120,000 mi runs great ) I can retire this truck for the engine, what do you think the costs to marinize the Cummins would be? Will it fit, does yours have a different oil pan, been told they are a little tall for the compartment. What about electronics & harnesses, checked into reconditioned marine 6BTA's they run $10K - $15K complete with dash, harnesses, ect...

Thanks
Abster

[prowlersfish]

Heavy, noisy, poor fuel economy and leaks oil. Also forget ever planing your boat again. If you want to turn your boat into a trawler, there are much better choices in diesels.

heavy yes , noise for sure , poor fuel economy compared to a four stroke diesel but still good , much better then gas . In a low hour pleasure boat oil leaks should not be a issue . forget going fast or getting on plane

that also is a very tall engine do you plan on moving the cabin door ? also the oil pan may not clear

I like the 71 series D.D. diesels but that has to the one of the top mismatches for your boat .

plus its a lot money and time to change over to diesel , you think your having issues now just wait

anyone who would sell you that engine and tell you its the right one for the job and will work . I would run from as I would not trust them

BTW both me and danny are Diesels Boaters

[RWS]

Yanmar makes a couple of GREAT 4 cylinder diesels.

If you want a link to someone who actually did a Yanmar diesel repower of a similar sized boat, let me know.

RWS

[prowlersfish]

I will run the numbers later but I don't think you will be able to turn a larger wheel rember you cutting the HP in half at half the rpm so the prop you have now may be close .

hows your boat do a 2000 rpm now ?

[RWS]

This repower was done on a 28' Carver. You might want to go with the next step up engines, however take a look at the performance numbers and economy and all you will say is WOW!

I have also included a forum link on this repower at my other haunt over at boatered which includes photos.

Hope this helps.

RWS
====================================


Repowering Your Boat - Bob Benton
I repowered with Yanmar diesels replacing the stock Mercruiser MIE230’s. I used twin Yanmar 4JH4-THE engines along with the existing Borg-Warner Velvet Drive trannys (1 to 1) and Walker V drives (2 to 1). The engines are rated at a continuous 110 HP each at 3200 RPM. The engines are not yet fully broken in so I haven’t been able to do a complete performance sheet but so far it averages 24 MPH at WOT and 18 MPH at 2800 RPM cruise. Mileage I don’t yet know since I don’t have a flo-scan.

So far, I am thrilled with the repower. I love to cruise to the Bahamas and putt around in the small remote islands in The Bimini’s, Berry’s and Exuma’s. Before I was always limited by range with the gas engines. That will not be a problem any longer.

With the repower I lost 5 MPH WOT speed and 4 MPH cruise speed. But, from the preliminary numbers I am seeing, my mileage more than doubles at WOT and almost triples at cruise. Then, if running at 7.5 KTS, which is my usual putt along speed, the mileage is absolutely amazing.

My total expenditures were around $45 G’s but that includes a few extra things and upgrades I had done at the same time: completely rebuilt both trannys and one V drive, bought one new V drive because of counter rotation, all new halon system, bottom paint, redo waterline pin stripes, etal.
----------------------------------------------------------

here's the link to the forum discussion with pix

http://www.boatsafe.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=134786

[Danny Bailey]

My son marinized two 4BT Cummins fork lift engines and put them in his 28 ' Bertram. Many times he has said he would have been money ahead to have bought two marine Re-Man's.

I bought used marine take-outs for my repower. One was a good engine that just needed minor repairs. The other one required a complete overhaul. Still a large outlay plus I had to buy two new transmissions for $4K each.

[k9th]

Sounds like a big and risky project. If it were me, I would seriously consider the wisdom of those who have done it before taking that big step. No more getting on plane???? Slower overall performance???? That may be OK for a few days, but consider that this is a costly and permanent change.

Good luck!

[jav]

I've done this and have a few recommendations.

1) stick with a marine engine versus trying to marinize a non marine variant.

2) This is a big project that requires a lot of commitment and planning. The devil is in the details. The engine, transmission, shaft /prop end up being easy decisions IF you've sweated the details first. If not- you could make a costly mistake. Everything from logisitcs to guages to controls to fuel system to exhaust to air/water intakes to dampers to beds must be considered FIRST.

3) If you sweat the details, are good with a wrench, and are more prone to "finish" projects than just "start" them- this can be done economically and with great success.

4) I'm not sure Detroits would be my first choice nor would I invest in a big dollar engine unless you REALLY like the boat and plan to keep it long term. You will get pennies on the dollar for an expensive refit.

5) There are many great deals on good running take out diesels that would be a great fit on your boat. There are even more used up, tired, someone elses problem diesels out there "cheap". The trick is knowing the difference between the 2 and if your not real savy yourself, don't part with any money until you have someone that knows their stuff OK the deal.

6) Diesels can be both good and bad. If your going to run your engines sporatically and for very few hours yearly- I wouldn't recommend the change unless you want and will enjoy the project. They are much more economical to run BUT- it will take a long time for the economy to make up the price of admission. I beleive they are safer. They get way from ethanol headaches but in it's place you have algea and are more limited with fuel docks. They are not as sociable as gas engines. Most will be louder, smokier, smellier, dirtier and vibrate significantly more. Having said that, most that have them (including me) would never go back.

7) you really need to honestly look at how you plan to use your boat and undertake this project with eyes wide open. If you have the right mindset and are OK with all the above, this is very doable for reasonable short money, perhaps under 10K total IF you sweat the details.

Good luck with the decision.

[prowlersfish]

After reading you post I see your talking about the 53 series not the 71 ,
most of what I say still goes but this engine is even nosier then the 71 series , I spend many a hour on a boat powered by one of these and my ears are still ringing ,

one reason there so noisy is they are 2 cycle

The 453 is also a tall engine 36" from top to bottom

[AbsterMcgee]

Thanks Guys

After considering all mentioned I am going to go the easy way, the boat is used for recreational fishing & Day trips, desiel is going to be way to cost prohibitive, so what I have found is an inboard, reverse rotation, brand new, 5.7L ( 325 HP ) Chevrolet MPI/EFI complete marine engine that will mate to my existing Velvet Drive, the engine is virtually a plug & play version with all electronics mounted, pigtail provided to wire up dash & gauges, ect..., for < $10K, 2 yr warranty, this will give me the least headaches and down time.

Here is the link to the engine I'm considering
http://www.michiganmotorz.com/complete- ... p-123.html

Thanks All
Abster

[MattSC]

Sounds like a good choice, I went through the same thing 7yrs ago, was thinking of a 240hp Yanmar, or a new gas engine for my F-26. Went with the Crusader 5.7MPI and couldn't be happier with it. One thing I had to do on mine after installation was to relocate the hose from the thermostat housing to the Manifold. On the Crusader Manifold there are two locations the hose can enter the manifold. Due to the angle of the engine I had to use the lower fitting so the manifold would get adequate cooling and not have a hot spot. She barely fits under the deck, so make sure you take good measurements. Good luck and let us know how you make out.
Matt

[prowlersfish]

Good Idea , but maybe a poor brand choice


I wound look at buying a name brand engine like Crusader, PCM or MerCruiser, As you have dealers all over if you have a warranty issue . where is the nearest Michigan Motorz dealer ? what if you need parts ?The engine looks like a re-labeled name brand motor but when you need parts they go by the engine # so you maybe out of luck locally



Michigan Motorz maybe a fine company but hands on support is every thing . so you could increase down time with a new motor

Have you had a pro look at the engine you have now

[AbsterMcgee]

Thanks Guys,

Prowler, have done compression check on all cylinders, 90-100 lb, all within 10% of each other but should be 115-135 lb, the motor is tired, as my guy ( very experienced machinist / engine rebuilder ) says " this motor ows you nothing ) 34 years old has already out performed it life expectancy, not to say it can't be worked, the rebuild would be no problem if it weren't for the Camshaft, Dist Drive Gear, & Lifters, Reverse rotation can be hard to find parts, electrical wiring is old, hard to get parts, now it's burning up coils, I think I am going to strip all the wiring out and start from scratch, starting with the mechanics first, fuse terminals and buss bars seem to be in pretty good shape but everything going to and from them looks like crap! I will check out new popular brands such as you mentioned, if withing a couple of grand of MM's price probably will be worth it to stay local.

How do you feel about MPI vs Carb engines?

Matt, thanks for the words, I too think this is the best way to go. Engine looks good, nice & clean, I would post a picture of mine but it's a little to scarey

Thanks All
Abster