Need some advice on varnishing

[yorklyn]

Hello again,
im in the process of putting sapelle mahogany veneer panels in my cabin. I have never varnished anything in my life and was looking for some recommendations and advice from someone with experience.
I have researched it some and it sounds like i should use an epoxy to seal the wood with two or three coats then 5 to 8 coats of varnish. I was thinking of using west system epoxy with 207 clear hardner to seal it and then Epifanes Gloss Clear Varnish on top????
Do you think gloss will be too much?
I understand one of the most important things is to keep everything totally clean and free of dust. roll and tip the epoxy and sand after it cures, then apply varnish ,wait 24 hrs , sand and repeat over and over . sanding every other coat.

does this sound correct?

[jordan]

Epiphane is a great product. I used 10 coats on my exterior teak using only Epiphane high gloss, diluting like the instructions say then switching to straight out of the can. My interior I sanded lightly and used Epiphane satin. I think gloss or satin would look good on the interior. Diluting per instructions, the varnish really soaks in to the wood. I've had the gloss on the exterior for 4 years now and is just starting to show a little wear. Good luck with whatever you choose and keep posting pics

[1967 seavoyager]

A couple coats of wood sealer (Interlux or Pettit) then at least 2 coats of Interlux # 60 Satin finish. That will look real nice.

[Allen Sr]

I would sand every coat because if you don't if one coat don't adhere well then you will get peeling eventually.

[todd brinkerhoff]

I'd go the epoxy then varnish route. You'll use a lot less varnish and if you have to revarnish you'll only have to remove a few layers. Sand after every coat, and strain your varnish, and get a high quality brush. The West system with clear hardener is appropriate. Tedious job, but go slow and sand, sand, sand.

[297Elegante]

Brush in one direction and brush into the wet edge. Don't over work it. You don't need an epoxy on interior woodwork. I've used many different build up products to help save time, energy and even money. Have had ok to good results.

The most important part... Post photos!

[todd brinkerhoff]

If not the West's epoxy then I would at least seal the wood with a sealer like Smith's CPES or similar. That is pretty easy and you won't have to worry about build up of the Wests. The CPES will help the Varnish "stick" to the wood. It just provides a good "substrate" for the varnish. Especially teak, which is very oily.

[summer storm]

I've done a lot of varnishing and I'm still not to the level that I would like to be but here is what I've been told by the pro's to do. 2 of sealer, 4 coats on exterior, followed by 4- 8 coat of straight varnish. The pro's add 333 brushing liquid to the varnish but I can't seem to keep full coverage when I use it. When ever possible lay the wood flat and varnish it before installation, this will prevent runs and you can lay it on thicker. Sand between the sealer coats and the first couple of coats of varnish and use a green pad between the rest. Just a scuff, 220 minimum. You can hot coat the sealer if you wait about 2-3 hours and always give the vanish 24 hours between coats.

Try a practice piece first to learn how to pull the varnish on the wood.

I just finished varnishing the panel and decking below and they came out like glass, everyday after work, scuff and a coat.

[yorklyn]

First let me say that how much I appreciate all of the help from everyone on this forum! My wife still cant get over how quick i can get this many responses to a question I just asked yesterday! Thank you everyone!

I have a few more questions. Alot of people have mentioned using a sealer . Todd mentioned cpes sealer, is a "sealer" simply an epoxy base coat?
I was at west marine today talking with the manager (who i have ironically become pretty good friends with during my renovation!) He was telling me that he did not feel it was necessary to use an epoxy as a sealer since they were interior panels . he recommended thinning the first two or three coats of Epifanes varnish then three or four un thinned coats . he also tried to talk me out of "gloss" and into a "satin" finish for the interior and said to lightly sand before every new coat. The Epifanes satin is a "rubbed effect"???? I know what a satin finish is but not sure what "rubbed effect" means?
I know Jordan said his was a gloss finish. Summer Storm , is yours gloss too?
My hat goes off to you "wood" boat guys! I'm overwhelmed by having to apply 8 coats to 2 panels, good lord I can't imagine what you poor souls go through every year! LOL

[Big D]

I wouldn't go epoxy for interior but that's my opinion, don't feel it's needed and way too expensive. You'll get better penetration by properly diluting the varnish you decide to go with. If you do decide to use the epoxy, DO NOT sand the epoxy until you get rid of the amine blush on the surface first or you will imbed it into the epoxy and it will affect your finish coats.

[todd brinkerhoff]

The 207 hardener won't produce an amine finish. Either will any of the Smith's products. If its something other than that, and there is a chance of amine on the hardened epoxy finish, water and a green pad will take care of it. The CPES is really just a primer epoxy that is absorbed by the wood that will provide an outstanding substrate and adhesion surface for your varnish. It's best to apply the first coat of varnish when the cpes is still tacky. If you plan on using a stain, you must use it before the cpes or your stain will not penetrate the wood. I know people say its not necessary on an interior, but a boat always has humidity, and this assists in controlling some of the expansion and contraction of wood which inevitably causes lifting of paint and varnish. By thinning varnish, you are attempting to get it to absorb into the wood to achieve the same effect. Of course, either way will work.

[todd brinkerhoff]

Summer storm,

Those pieces look awesome...Nice work

[297Elegante]

Todd,

I agree on not needing the epoxy inside the boat. I use it on my exterior teak, but chose not to on anything inside. The epoxy, as far as I am aware, is there for wood exposed to the elements, specifically water. This shouldn't be an issue inside the boat.

As for the gloss, satin, rubbed effect. Most will say go satin or rubbed effect inside. If you choose this route though, it is suggested to build coats with a gloss first then apply only one or two satin/RE coats at the end. The satin/RE if used to build can hide or mute the grain, where the gloss doesn't have the additives that might do this.

I went high gloss on my cabin wood, figuring if I didn't like the look, I would sand put down a satin finish. So far I like it a lot, but I have far less wood than most Trojans.

[summer storm]

Todd P, yes it's gloss. I like the satin finish too but gloss on the flooring seem to make the boat "pop". I used 2 coats of sealer before the varnish.

Todd B, thanks, it was a lot of trial and error.

[Big D]

There is no way I would chance sacrificing the labour it takes to apply 8 coats of varnish over any epoxy resin in spite of their no amine blush claims. Used such a product once for this exact application and had finish issues despite explaing to the supplier what I was doing. What a nightmare. The rep's answer after the fact was, "well it's a natural by-product of the curing process but the amount in this product is negligable" Well, it would have been great to know that ahead of time. A simple wash is all it takes so claims or not, why take the chance. Trojan made my boat with simple basic finishes and methods, and 40 years later, the original interior finish still looks good after many years of hot humid summers and sub-zero winters.